So a lot of men are guilty of seeing a girl with a full face of makeup done to appear "natural" and think "See women look the best without makeup! I'd never judge a woman for not wearing any!" Which of course is kind of hilarious. Women poke fun at us for this and I don't think they're wrong to do so.

However, I feel like I have noticed a lot of women doing the exact same thing when it comes to the male body and muscles. I have seen a lot of women pointing to a man who clearly has spent half a decade in the gym building muscle, probably on a strict diet for the entire time, probably goes to the gym religiously, but he won't have a full 6 pack and might be at 18% or so body fat. Then they'll say "see this is what women mean when we say we don't like gym bros, we don't need huge bulky muscles like body builders" the entire time, they're talking about an off season body builder.

It's just funny to me.

Watching a group of gals prance around going "haha look what I get to do freely just because I'm hetero" in front a crowd of people who had to fight tooth and nail to get to do that same thing not 12 years ago is so distasteful and disrespectful. You want a space where you can dance and men won't touch you? Go camping.

Edit: Wow, 3k upvotes?! Thank you everyone so much for all your interaction, your support, all the karma. I've never had a post take off like this before. Thank you.

Now that traffic is dying down, let me say I'm sorry I couldn't keep up with all the comments. There were too many. Of the ones I read, honestly I was surprised by all the misogyny masquerading as outrage. The post was specifically about Bachelorette parties, yet so many people took this to meaning banning all women from gay bars. It's honestly weird learning how some of you apparently feel like all women have to get married, that they can't just go to the gay bars to hang and have fun not as a Bachelorette, and then tried projecting that to sound like you were defending them against me, when i never said that. Women are all individuals. Maybe try talking to one some time instead of trying to play the white knight.

Another common comment was "what about lesbians?" Show me one lesbian who wants to have their Bachelorette party at a gay bar and then I'll entertain your argument. I saw one asking about bisexual girls, and fair, I forgot to take them into account. Gay marriage was their fight too.

And that's what this post was about: marriage equality is still relatively new. So many people took this as an "i must hate women" post. Yall need to apologize to your English Lit teachers for failing reading comprehension. Some of you didn't even know what I meant by the 12 year mark. I can only assume those commenters were straight and didn't know since it didn't apply to them, but literacy applies to everyone.

And finally the fixation on the camping quip at the end from some of you. My apologies, I was unaware every single sentence ever uttered in a post had to be 100% serious, no hyperbole, no jest, no exasperation. One can only hope every single one of your posts follows that same rule.

no matter what you post, 90% of the replies are going to be filled with arrogant know-it-alls who try and demean your intelligence by asking you rhetorical questions, instead of answering your own, or find any way to make you feel utterly stupid, they’ll downvote your post/comment for literally asking anything. don’t get me wrong, there are plenty of great people on reddit who aren’t like this, but the vast majority of its user base consist of these type of people, it makes me not even want to use the app anymore.

Emphasis on in public.

I was eating brunch with some friends at a restaurant when I, a grown adult in my 30s, said "fuck that shit" to something my friend said. It should be noted that all of us had cursed at some point during this conversation, but we weren't cursing like sailors. Just normal women in their 30s who aren't afraid of words.

There was a family sitting across from us, and the mother abruptly stood up and started waving a waitress down. One came over, and the mother pointed directly at me, and asked if I could be removed for being inappropriate. The waitress asked both their table and ours what happened, and then told the mother that she wouldn't be removing us just for some casual cursing.

In response, the mother grabbed her children, pretty roughly mind you, and escorted them out before they were done eating. Her poor husband looked on as if this was not the first time she had done this.

My gripe is that it's not my job to protect your precious baby's ears from the f bomb in a public setting.

Again, we weren't cursing in every single word of every sentence, but we were talking like the adults we are. We weren't being inappropriate about it; it's not like we kneeled down to get in the 5 year old's face and said fuck shit damn hell at them or anything. And honestly, if they had come over and politely asked us to tone it down, we probably would have. Instead, she jumped right to trying to get us kicked out.

Some people are just too delicate for society, imo.

EDIT: Thanks for proving my take to be truly hot!

A few blanket statements:

I don't care what others think of me, it's an exercise in futility. You will never make 100% of the people around you happy, so I don't go out of my way to try. The people I care about are good with me, and I'm good with that.

This place was NOT a family friendly establishment. I think the three kids in question may have been the only ones there at all, and I didn't even see them until I had a woman pointing her finger in my face and yelling at wait staff. Think, children allowed but not entirely welcome. It's not like we were cursing up a storm in the children's museum.

I have been and will continue to report comments that are name calling. You can think what you want of an adult who chooses to curse in public, but calling me a degenerate, trash, a shithead, etc. are really not more mature of you. Pot, kettle, and all that.

Happy Sunday, ya'll!

EDIT 2: the way ya'll are foaming at the mouth to call me a cunt over a few curse words is really something. Just gotta say.

I feel it’s very obvious but this runs in the same vein as them calling any guy that doesn’t fit their standards “gay” or a “ponk”. Seen multiple women calling their ex “twinks” because they were bad people and it’s just so weird.

It’s true that nobody owes you romance, and the same goes for friendship. You didn’t get what you were looking for, and you’re free to move on. If a woman asked me out and I turned her down, I likely wouldn’t wish to remain friends. Trying to maintain a platonic relationship with someone whom you know is into you is just going to lead to a lot of awkwardness down the road, and I would rather not deal with that.

I'm not a misogynist or a red pill bro. I'm pretty pro-feminism. I think that life as a woman tends to be a bit more difficult. Like I as a man don't have to be careful walking home at night, I don't get catcalled, I don't have people assume incompetence because of my gender, there aren't laws being passed to prevent me from getting medical procedures or being drafted to stop access to contraceptives. But I do think the one part of life that they have that is easier is dating and pursuing romantic relationships.

In heterosexual dating dynamics, it is very much a feast v. famine when it comes to men who are widely appealing to women and men who are not. Most men tend fall into the famine category, so chances for romantic connections are sparse. I know that attraction is "subjective" but subjective doesn't mean randomized, and there are men who are widely appealing to most women. Genetically, men are built to be attracted to a much larger portion of women so there's a lot less women who experience the lack of attention that the typical man experiences.

Also with men having the typically take the role of initiator, you also have to make yourself the vulnerable one and make yourself open to rejection much more often. Men kind of just have to harden themselves to rejection whereas women don't really have to do that. It sucks, but it just is. As men, there's also a large amount of societal expectations, for men to invest a lot more emotionally and financially early on. Men usually don't have a roster of women, we have to devote our efforts to the one woman giving us a chance and impress her. Otherwise, we get pushed to the side for the next guy. It's like where job applicants and women are the hiring manager.

And don't get me wrong, when women say "men are worried about being embarrassed, women are worried about violence". That's not an untrue statement and it's a serious worry. But when it comes to dating, violence is the worst case scenario, it's not the typical or even a very likely scenario. It's not unrealistic, but it is also uncommon for a date to end in violence towards women. It's a lot more likely to happen in a committed long term relationship or by a friend/acquaintance than it is by a random guy you go on a date with, and when it is, again it is very rare. So I thinking using that as the sole justification on how it's harder for women is just not exactly very fair.

Mcdonalds? Sure bring em.
A waterpark? Great, let the kids play.
Church? Ok cool everyone is welcome.
Planes and trains? Fine, we don’t have a choice, you need to travel.

A movie theatre????
A quiet upper scale restaurant???
A tennis match at Wimbledon???
A chess tournament event???
Golfing???

If they are around the age of 7-10 and well behaved then it’s fine. Otherwise, LEAVE YOUR KIDS AT HOME. Please stop trying to make us all suffer for your personal choices and then cry when you get kicked out for the disruption.

I’m really emphasising the movie theatre one. (Kids movies excluded) Why are you bringing your 4yo to watch Sinners? There is absolutely zero justification to bring a child to the cinema for that. Don’t even bring them in for Marvel movies. They don’t know or care what is happening and we don’t want to hear crying/giggling/footsteps while watching. Please spare us I BEG

Edit: a real sensitive parent sent my username to the reddit self harm bot as a false claim that I am suicidal. This is just one example of parents doing anything but looking in the mirror because they can’t handle being called out on being a terrible parent. We don’t want your kids around because you don’t raise them correctly… and it shows.

“Never hit a woman” is drilled into boys at every stage of their life. But “never hit a man” is NOT drilled into women at every stage of life, or at all. So there are zero social consequences for that behavior.

“never hit a woman” that rule comes with social enforcement. Men who break it are socially shamed. They are called cowards, pussies, punks, pussy, woman-beaters, and abusers. There are also physical consequences, bystanders (typically male) gang up on the man who hit a woman (no matter if the woman is the person who initiated and escalated the altercation and the man was defending himself). Even teenage boys can face that

Women aren’t routinely called cowards, punks, pussy, man beaters, or abusers for attacking men. Girls don’t grow up with “never hit a boy” enforced at every stage of life. boys experience the reverse. Women who attack men also don’t face the same social consequences of physical intervention from bystanders. Other women aren’t generally expected to step in and restrain them, much less attack them the way men may be attacked for hitting women.

I understand why we teach boys to exercise restraint. Differences in strength can make these confrontations dangerous, and discouraging violence can protect women and prevent escalation. My problem is the lack of a similarly enforced expectation that women keep their hands to themselves.

A woman can slap, shove, or repeatedly hit a man, and people will laugh, minimize it, or focus on what he supposedly did to upset her. If he eventually hits back, that becomes the entire incident. Her aggression becomes background information, while his response becomes the only behavior anyone considers worth condemning.

That puts the responsibility for both people’s behavior on him. He’s expected to manage his own anger, absorb her aggression, anticipate how badly she could get hurt, and prevent the situation from escalating. Mind you, all while being physically attacked. She’s not responsible for choosing to attack him, regardless of whether he could seriously hurt her.

This expectation extends to teenage boys and younger boys dealing with girls. We tell them not to hit girls, then mock them with “you got beat up by a girl” when they don’t fight back. If they defend themselves, they’re shamed for hitting a girl. If they show restraint, they’re humiliated for being weak. What exactly are we encouraging?

Most importantly, we should socially reward men and boys who practice restraint. If someone keeps his composure, protects himself, and avoids escalating a confrontation, that deserves respect. Calling him weak or laughing at undermines the behavior we want to see. In a physical altercation, both parties should be expected to show restraint, not just men. Both parties should be able to regulate and control their composure, not just men. Both parties should be practicing some form of deescalation, not just the men.

There's a strange contradiction in how people discuss men's mental health.

We're constantly told that men need to open up more, express their emotions, and stop bottling everything up. And I agree with that.

But when a man actually talks about something bothering him, there's a tendency among some people to dismiss his concerns, mock him for being sensitive, or tell him that other people have it worse.

How exactly does that encourage emotional openness?

You can't simultaneously criticize men for suppressing their feelings and then reinforce the very behavior you're criticizing by punishing them for expressing those feelings.

Not every complaint is reasonable, and nobody is obligated to agree with everything someone says.

But there's a difference between challenging someone's perspective and ridiculing them for expressing it.

If we genuinely want men to be more emotionally open, then we need to stop treating their vulnerability as something to mock whenever we find their concerns inconvenient.

I feel like you guys are really annoying when it comes to this subject. Babies are going to cry. A lot of people like to say well why are you taking a baby on a plane? you don’t know what’s going on, maybe they’re flying to another state for a funeral or someone’s in the hospital. I never judge people who have crying babies because being on a plane as a grown adult woman is scary enough imagine what a baby‘s feeling.
Now if it’s like a toddler who is just running up and down the halls and the parents aren’t doing anything that is one thing but babies can’t tell you what they want so they’re gonna cry! And 9/10 the parents are more stressed out than you. But seriously if it’s not big of an issue, just bring headphones or don’t fly like I don’t understand why this is so annoying to some people hahah.
Again, i do understand if it’s like a toddler or a child kicking your seat running screaming that is ANNOYING especially if the parents aren’t doing anything. I hate parents like this bc why aren’t you disciplining your child 😩

I got a vasectomy two years ago, and an odd thing I discovered was revealing that fact acts as a sort of social barometer for proving if someone has kids that they love or resent.

People who adore their children always have two reactions when they hear that Ill never have any. Sadness and bargaining. Its always "aawww your not?! Why? Youd be a great father! You'll miss out on so much! Watching them grow and learn and play... thats so sad. But maybe you'll change your mind. Then you can adopt or foster or get it reversed."

People who resent (even hate) their children react with anger and threats. "What?! Youre not having kids! But you gotta! Its what people do! Thats selfish of you! Well some vasectomies don't take. Accidents happen. Then what?!" Someone actually said that to me, a 50 year old woman. When I explained that I did the tests multiple times proving I was steral and can have as much unprotected sex as I wanted without fear, she looked me dead in the eye and said "well your wife could get gang raped. Then you'd be stuck with a kid." Without skipping a beat I said she'd probably want an abortion to which this 50 year old mother of three called me a monster and went to H.R. I found out her kids havent spoken to her in over a decade.

The threats are always the same as are me replies. "Youll regret this later in life." Maybe, maybe not. "Who will take care of you when youre old?!" The care provider's in the nice nursing home we csn afford to go to because we didnt drop 2 tax brackets just to have kids. They always come from people who very obviously regret and resent their own children.

Honestly, one of the biggest things I struggle with in pro lifers claiming abortion is murder is the whole rape exception thing.

If you genuinely believe abortion is literally murdering an innocent child, why would it suddenly become acceptable because the woman was raped? The embryo/fetus didn’t magically become a different species because its conception involved rape. If killing it is murder, then it would still be murder.

A huge proportion of people who identify as pro-life support rape exceptions. In a 2025 poll, 73% of self-identified pro life respondents supported exceptions for rape, incest or saving the pregnant woman’s life.

If the crime is really killing an innocent baby, why does whether the woman consented to sex change whether that killing is acceptable?
If you say abortion is okay when she was raped, but not okay when she willingly had sex, you’re saying that pregnancy is an acceptable consequence you have to endure because you chose to have sex and that sounds a hell of a lot less like protecting babies and a lot more like policing women’s sexual behaviour.

Once the argument becomes about whether or nor you consented to sex, we’re no longer talking about protecting a baby, we’re talking about using someone’s body as a consequence for having sex.

I understand women tend to want a man who is confident and approaches them, I understand women probably have worse fear of rejection than the average man and I understand that being a women comes with more risk in the dating market than it does for men.

With all that said, women are also told that their dream partner is going to just show up and they will live happily ever after. However, if you look at the world, there are tons of lonely women, we say men never approach them.

The thing is, men never get approached, so your chances of success with a guy is a lot higher. I’ve been asked out by a women and it was the biggest compliment ever in my eyes. I didn’t think she was this and that because she made the first move.

It’s not going to guarantee a great relationship or that they will be open to you, however neither does a guy approaching you.

Life is too short to keep waiting and end up loney. I understand some women will die on the hill of never approaching but that doesn’t have to be you.

Generally speaking men tend to accept a lot less when it comes to dating. It makes sense why they've sort of checked out on the stereotypical motions of it.

Dating "should" be about two people getting to know each other while having fun doing mutually enjoyable activities but social media has sort of torched that.

If we are objective much of the "labor" of dating is put on men. It takes a lot to face this sort of rejection after putting in so much emotional, physical and financial effort.

Over time if you are "successful" in dating a person the amount of reciprocation you actually receive is abysmal. Not all women but a lot operate under this subconscious belief that their presence is enough. Not taking into account that presence is often fixed on what you are doing for her.

Most men have never been asked out or taken on dates even by their bonafide girlfriends. The "bare minimum" that certain groups demand is often too heavy to offer for the men they claim to like. This doesnt even touch on simple things like compliments and encouragement.

Women tend to unintentionally consume a lot of emotional space in dating. This overtime causes men to check out and be less willing to continually put themselves out there to face lack or even rejection.

Edit: It says A LOT that I didnt utter a single negative word about women but many of the commentators are trying to attack me personally and nothing actually mentioned in the post. Ive had women take me out on dates. The point is MOST men have never had that kind of reciprocation. If you truly believe pointing this out is incel behavior then you need help.

I mean, title. When i hear criticism to a Western country, I never hear a positive control against which Western countries should strive toward.

“Britain is racist!”

But never:

“Britain is racist! They should be more like Nigeria, South Africa, Saudi Arabia or China!”

And what’s more, as a paradox, because elites decided to make Western countries multicultural and multiracial, i think that’s resulted in more of these shrill calls of racism. I’m fairly certain the topic of racism is more commonly brought up in Britain than…Poland or Hungary. The latter two are certainly more derided for being racist than, say, Dubai, but probably less so than Britain.

And if the argument is that’s because Britain now has non-natives or non-indigenous populations, then it goes back to evaluation is only criticism and never comparative praise. Britain and much of the West are objectively more tolerant societies. Few if any societies will put immigrants and refugees in state funded housing. Especially if those refugees were from an entirely different continent.

There’s no self-awareness or fair assessment. The West’s generosity is re-paid with scorn. And it’s ironic, because there’s very solid data that European natives got a raw deal from multiculturalism.

Next time we hear how racist the West is, ask for a non-Western nation beacon of tolerance and inclusion we in the West should model ourselves towards.

I would conclude that we’re being racist or bigoted toward Western societies if we’re tacitly admitting everywhere else is worse. Call for Nigeria to be more inclusive before you take shots at Finland or Norway.

Plenty of women prefer 50/50 and actually do it. This isn't about them.

This is about the ones who expect the man to pay but when asked why, almost none of them just say "because I like it." Because I think many feel it's bad feminism or that it can come off as entitled. Instead it becomes about the man needing to make up for the cost of getting ready, or even some systemic injustice like the wage gap or the imbalance of pregnancy and birth. Or because men owe them something for historical reasons.

Okay. Cool. But let's test that.

If it's about the wage gap, what happens when she makes more than him? Does she pay? Because from what I've seen, the answer is usually no.

If it's about the beauty tax, then what about a guy who shows up in a nice suit and expensive cologne? Does she now feel obligated to pay? More likely the expectation for him to pay becomes even higher.

If it's about men having systemic advantages, what happens when he grew up in foster care? Or in the projects? Or was abused? Or has a disability? Or is a minority who's been screwed over his whole life? Does she grab the check? Does she say you've had it harder than me, this one's on me?

Probably not.

Here's the thing. Nobody actually cares that some women like being courted. That's fine. The dynamic isn't the problem.

The problem is pretending it's about fairness or justice when it's just a preference. You like a man who invests in you. You like feeling special. Say that. Own it.

I feel like every dude I talk to puts in no effort and just complains. They do the bare minimum and just swipe on a dating app if that. As a guy who’s average looking or slightly below average get some better fits, nicer pics, and find a hobby. Play to your strengths and hating a gender online is lame.

Spend 5 minutes on Reddit, and you'll very quickly discover that everybody is perfectly morally aligned with their own behaviors and always will be, is an investing genius, some sort of health guru, has unprecedented anthropological insight, not only isn't racist but knows exactly how to identify racsists and racist behavior (white supremacy being the ubiquitous pathology), and understands economics better than any other person before or since.

I just took a walk and passed by 2 houses which had these stupid, high frequency producing boxes in the front lawn, and theyre the WORST THING

Not only does it freak out every dog that walks past the damn lawn, but it also hurts like hell for anyone who passes who happens to have half decent hearing. And makes it so kids in the neighborhood sure as hell aren't wanna go outside, with that bs constantly in their ears

just because YOU cant hear the stupid and infuriating sound, doesnt mean that nobody else can.

“People only commit crime because their needs aren’t being met!”

“People are only obese because they lack access to healthy food!”

“People only live paycheck to paycheck because of corporate greed!”

Like, I hate to break it to you guys, but some people are just not that smart. Lots of people are just impulsive, lack discipline, prioritize instant gratification over long-term success, and make reckless decisions despite knowing the consequences.

Give people the choice between committing a crime and not committing one, eating healthy and eating junk food, exercising and sitting on the couch, or saving money and buying frivolous crap, and plenty will choose the option that works against their long-term interests and will be happy to do so.

Redditors love acting like they’re smarter than everyone else, yet whenever a societal problem comes up, they suddenly behave as though they’ve never in their lives met a person who is stupid, irresponsible, or self-destructive. Everything needs an external explanation wrapped in therapy speak, as though individual agency is a complete non-factor.

It’s like Redditors operate under a weird fallacy where they assume everyone wants to make the optimal choice at all times and only make a bad choice when there is literally no other option. I don’t know how you could possibly arrive at this conclusion or think this is at all representative of reality after spending any amount of time in the real world.

There’s a kernel of truth in these statements because these are legitimate limiting factors for SOME people, but eliminating poverty wouldn’t stop plenty of people from choosing to commit crime. Lots of people will still pick McDonald’s even if they have access to healthy food. Lots of people would still choose to sit on the couch if they had a free, in-home gym. Lots of people would still live paycheck to paycheck even if their salary doubled because they’re bad at managing money and are impulsive.

Insisting the opposite also glosses over the enormous population of people living in poverty globally who do not commit crimes, people who live in areas with poor investment and still eat healthy, people who work full time and still find time to exercise, and people who don’t earn much money but still budget appropriately.

At the end of the day, lots of people make bad choices simply because they want to, not because society is “forcing them” to do so. The level to which Reddit denies this, and refuses to even engage with this reality, is very confusing and strange. Even acknowledging this is seen as taboo for some reason.

I just saw someone else’s post basically saying the opposite unless fertility was a prior issue, and it made me think of my own “unpopular” opinion, especially as a gen z.
I agree with one commenter that saying “hoping for” a baby sounds better than “trying for” even though it can come off as…hoping for a baby? What else are you expecting?
But seriously, we all know how babies are made, right? And I hate the gross exaggeration, too. “Thanks for letting us know your RAWDOGGING ALL NIGHT, EVERY NIGHT, ew!” Like, are you actually serious? And they are.

Like, unless you aren’t close with your family and friends, a baby is a massive change in lifestyle, and if you have people there to help you and support you, it can bring significant change to their lives, too.
Then there’s the health aspect of it. Pregnancy is dangerous for the mother and the baby. Delivery is dangerous for the mother and the baby. One or both could die at either stage, and that’s also why I don’t
Like the “compromise” to tell them once they’ve already delivered.

Just my thoughts, to each their own, but as a whole, I feel like it’s completely blown out of proportion and definitely one of the “immature” aspects of gen z that I fail to find funny

As a guy I semi-frequently see the most blatant obvious male pick-me’s and nobody calls it out and at the same time people call out female pick-me’s a whole lot. SOME(!!!)women can’t seem to recognize they are being pandered to and misled it’s honestly crazy. It seems so obvious to me maybe because I’m a guy too?

The reason Europeans insist that the USA has no culture is rooted in deep belief that “true” Americans are only and can only white, fat, and trashy. And, because of that mindset, they don’t believe African-Americans and Natives and Latino immigrants are ‘real’ Americans, even though the USA’s culture is it’s diversity.

side note: when i say Americans in this situation, im referring to US citizens.

Let me give some examples:

Suede: That's literally leather.

Wave: Like waving hello at someone or the ocean waves??

Chicago: Babes thats a US State if I'm not wrong

Stormy: That's something you'd probably name a pet 💀

Techno Mechanicus: First off thats a disrespect to Techno, and second, WHY. JUST WHY!!

Trump: Enough said.

Imagine you grow up, end up in high school, they're calling attendance and they say one of these names. Like I'd personally be laughing my ass off.

What are other diabolical names you guys have heard? These are just a few I can remember right now.

Edit:

I did not expect this to get as much attraction as it did. So I would like to say a few things because I'm tired of replying.

Thank you to everyone who corrected my geographical error; I take full accountability for being uneducated. Given I'm not from USA, I've only ever heard of Chicago so I assumed it was a state.